:: Bersa Talk ::

Hey Toni,

Nah, don't worry about it.  Actually I'm fairly confident that a new KT would perform just fine, which again is why I'm considering one.  I have no interest in the LCP or the P3AT since I already have a .380 and neither of these firearms would move me toward my goal of having a pistol in each caliber

My beef is when somebody says "hey, they messed up here and could do a little better" everybody starts jumping in with how reliable KTs are and how it's easy to fix that yourself, but that's not the issue.  The issue is the manufacturer isn't doing their job and I don't feel I should have to do it for them.  I'm not saying they need to use better materials or change the design.  They just need to tighten up on the QC and make sure their products are done correctly.  When I worked in plastics that kind of product output would have resulted in a write-up.  

I'm sure I could take the time and fix the problem myself but why should I?  If I go to a mechanic and he leaves the dirty paper floormat in my car and a shop rag on my dash I'm going to complain.  Sure it's easy enough for me to throw them away but that's not my job, it's theirs.  If I go back and they do it again, I'll go someplace else next time.

But that's just me,

Bronson

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"Each new generation born is in effect an invasion of civilization by little barbarians, who must be civilized before it is too late." T. Sowell
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Thunder .380
Browning HiPower
Kahr CW40
Kel-Tec P32
Ruger MK I
Ruger GP100
S&W 60

Well, I watched it happen yesterday.  I watched Kel-Tec lose two customers to the LCP based soley on the looks of the two pistols.  I was in a neighboring town and stopped into one of their LGSs to poke around.  A couple were looking at small autos and asked to see the Kel-Tec.  With it still sitting on the counter the sales guy put an LCP next to it.  The couple remarked how it looked like the same gun but it was "obvious the Ruger was much better quality".  The counter guy didn't say a thing he just let them go back and forth and eventually ended up selling two LCPs.  Just because the finished product looked better, no questions of reliabilty were asked.  The Kel-Tec looked like a lower quality weapon so it was assumed to be a lower quality weapon.  That's too bad for Kel-Tec because they're QC is pushing people to the competitor who is selling a more expensive less reliable but better looking gun.

Bronson 

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"Each new generation born is in effect an invasion of civilization by little barbarians, who must be civilized before it is too late." T. Sowell
--------------------------
Thunder .380
Browning HiPower
Kahr CW40
Kel-Tec P32
Ruger MK I
Ruger GP100
S&W 60

That is indeed a shame.

But you know, I have always failed to understand why a firearm can't look good too, as well as being functional.  It's a pride of ownership thing... and I recall as a kid staring wide-eyed with awe into the display cases admiring the deep bluing and craftsmanship that made the handguns works of art as well as practical tools.  Look what we get today by comparison.   It all boils down to money, right?  Different times, too... usually those display cases were at places like K-Mart or Sears, where "common folk" (i.e. not necessarily "gun nuts") frequented.

To a first-time buyer who doesn't know what to look for or what questions to ask, though, what else is there to base "quality" on than the appearance?  [You didn't say these people were first-time buyers, so I'm taking a big leap in assuming so... but obviously it was their first time looking for a tiny gun if they've never heard of Kel-Tec, right?]

John

Same thing here a few days ago Bronson. Guy asked for a KT. Gun store guy showed him one and then brought out a LCP. The guy went for the LCP. Aftward I asked why he showed something the customer didnt ask for. Gunstore guy said cuz he makes more profit on the LCP. I'm not sure what their margins are but that could be a variable that we havent even considered here?

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Whining is for little girls, babies, mommy’s boys and girly men.
SNIVELING? Now that’s an art form!

FS22
BT380dlx; P3AT; PPK
Beretta 92FS; CX4 Storm
BT45UC; FS1911dlx; Colt M1991A1; DW Bobtail
Taurus 38UL
CZ fnh Modell 27 WWII Luftwaffe issued to Hauptman Jaeduvel
+ old family guns

Another of the LGS owners has told me that as soon as the LCP becomes more available he's going to stop carrying the Kel-Tec .380.

Bronson

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"Each new generation born is in effect an invasion of civilization by little barbarians, who must be civilized before it is too late." T. Sowell
--------------------------
Thunder .380
Browning HiPower
Kahr CW40
Kel-Tec P32
Ruger MK I
Ruger GP100
S&W 60

i love my kel tec p11 been 100% reliable. my mag has never free fallin though any way to fix that.

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bersa thunder 380
keltec p11
taurus ul85
s&w model 910
walther p99
springfield xd9
walther p22

The LGS I frequent won't carry Kel-tec, say they're low-quality crap. But I'd heard from a few other sources that a lot of the the Northern KY LEOs are buying them as BUGs. Based on that and the great feedback from this forum, thought I'd give one a try. I recently picked up a used P3AT through a local surplus store that also happens to sell a few firearms. Went through 6-7 magazines at the range a couple of weeks ago with two FTFs. Primer did have a dent in it from the firing pin, but round didn't fire. I was using white box from Wally World and the Remington I usually use at the range in my Bersa, and I'm pretty sure they were Remington rounds (which I usually have a lot of success with in my T380). I wasn't getting nearly the accuracy the reviewer on Gunblast said he was getting, but I figure that is probably an issue with the shooter, not the firearm.

Either in pocket holster or with clip attached, it is very easy to carry, so convenience is a plus. Not a firm believer yet, but will give it good cleanings and a few more range trips before I make a final decision. Really not that concerned about the aesthetics of a pocket carry, but it has to work dependably.